La SRCM de Babuji et de son fils Umeshchandra
Voici le témoignage de A(nonyme), un indien qui a été membre de la SRCM créée à Lucknow (Uttar Pradesh, Inde) en 1945 par Babuji. Il y est entré comme simple abhyasi en 1987 et devenu précepteur vers 1996.
La version des faits historiques qu'on lui a rapporté est qu'à la mort de Babuji en 1983, Rajagopalachari a tenté de faire valoir ses droits à la présidence de la SRCM mais que cela a été contesté. Babuji l'aurait démis de l'ensemble de ses fonctions vers 1980. Un groupe de travail a été mis en place et S.P. Srivastava en a été nommé président.
En 1994, le fils de Babuji, Umeshchandra Saxena a fait valoir ses droits à la présidence et ils ont été reconnus. S.P. Srivastava a démissionné au profit d'Umeshchandra qui préside donc la SRCM historique depuis lors. En 1996, A. est parti aux Etats-Unis, nommé par Umeshchandra secrétaire de la SRCM historique dans ce pays. Il a créé un site web sur lequel il publiait les 2 lettres de nomination d'Umeshchandra et de Chari signées par Babuji. Cela a débuté une bataille juridique entre les 2 mouvements…
Comme le dit si justement Michael, il n'y a pas un, ni deux mais 3 mouvements aujourd'hui qui se réclament de l'héritage du Sahaj marg de Babuji : la SRCM historique présidée par Srivastava de 1983 à 94 puis par Umeshchandra depuis 1994, la SRCM® de Rajagopachari depuis 1983 qui est une société à but non lucratif enregistrée en Californie et enfin l'ISRC de Narayana depuis août 1991. Sans compter tous les individus qui ont démissionné et véhiculent en leur nom personnel les enseignements de Babuji (Kasturi, etc.) …
Vous pouvez retrouver plus complètement les extraits cités ci-dessous de la discussion entre A., Michael, Christian, Don et moi sur le blog de Michael (http://innercircleofsrcm.blogspot.com) :
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
At age 17 (1987) i had strong desire to understand the meaning and purpose of life. Studied Vivekananda, and started meditating on my own. I came across 'Reality at Dawn'. I was impressed and decided to meet Babuji.(I am an indian living in India). I met a local preceptor Mr.M. After couple of meetings he said "I know what you are looking for, I request you to join our mission. Give me six months of time. Do what i say for six month. At the end we will sit on same platform. If you feel i have wasted your time, your free to give me any abuses you like".
I was touched by the humility and openness. I told him, i would not question for one year.
Later during sittting and talks i realized, Babuji had passed in 1983. I went to Shahjanpur for 'Lalaji's Birthday celebration', the same year. I was already feeling the difference in my condition/experience the grace at Babuji's Samadhi and his house. As i got involved i learnt that there is some issue going on with Babuji's Sucessor. Mr.M told me that Babuji left none. We have a working president Dr.S.P.Srivastava.
I used to meet my preceptor almost three times a week. During talk, i understood that Chari is claiming the sucessorship and came to know about all the legal issues in India too. He mentioned to me that, while Babuji's body was still burning at Shahjanpur, Chari had the paper circulated that he is nominated as the president of mission. Chari was general secretary of the mission till 1980(?), he was removed from all postions after that. Chari was the only person appointed by Babuji to make new preceptors. My preceptor was made a preceptor by Chari!.
But he refused to accept chari as the representative. The personality he described to me about chari and what i read from your blogs are identical!
Infact, Chari send out a letter to my preceptor, that his preceptorship is cancelled, and his powers are revoked. He showed that letter to me when i went for a sitting to his home. Asked me to sit for a sitting and tell him how true it is. I felt no difference in the sitting, it was still the same grace i have been receiving.
Unfortunatly, my preceptor left us in 1993. Babuji that i know, SahajMarg i know, the grace i feel is all due to his efforts. In my very close association with him for six plus years, I have never, not even once, seen him lose his cool or a change in the tone or pitch of his voice. I was like his son, so there nothing hidden from me or as a matter of fact anyone. There was no 'inner circle'.
I had developed good relation with preceptors of neighboring cities too by that time. And i saw very similar personalities. None of them accepted Chari as the successor though.
Since they wanted to run the Mission, they met with the president S.P.Srivastava and decided on ways to make new preceptor and made new one for my city. I took regular sitting from him and felt similar grace too.
I have also heard from my preceptor that Andre Porey was a strong contender for the successorship. Babuji had more liking for him, but Lalaji disapproved him, since Lalaji felt that Andrey Pore or people around him are not introvert and would utilize the power for material purpose. I recollect this as i read your post on people dressed in black showing up for meditation.
As far as i know, my preceptor told me that till the end Babuji was always saying that i did not find one to nominate.
The center was working fine, but we got a letter now from Umeshchandra saxena that he is the sucessor representative. We all got copies of the letter that Babuji Maharaj wrote to him on mission letter head with Babuji's Signature.
I have seen the letter that Umeshchandra produced and the one that chari has produced. I still have copies of both. I rejected the copy chari produced simply by reading its content. Babuji, as i have known him from my preceptor, does nothing without mentioning his guru Lalaji Maharaj. A successor nomination letter without the name of Lalaji Maharaj is 'impossible'.
The letter that umeshchandra produced seemed more in line with Babuji's style. "By the grace of God and Lalaji Maharaj..."
I must mention here, my preceptor told me that when Babuji used to travel west, he used to leave few blank signed papers on mission letterhead for administrative reasons. Since he worked in court, he was very perticular and always checked back on the papers when he came back. In one of his last trips, he saw three blank signed letters were missing. He registered a complain at local police station for records.
Since one of the senior preceptor (he was one of the few, who had soul connection with Babuji-initiation) in neighbouring city, accepted that letter, we all accepted it.
I took sitting from umeshchandra when he came to my city. The sitting reminded me of the condition i felt, at Babuji's Samadhi and Babuji's house. Tremendous grace. But i was very perplexed with the petty talk and other behaviour of Umeshchandra. I question this to the Senior preceptor-whom we were relying on.
He agreed with my observation, asked me to watch and not react. I kept did not question much.
Umeshchandra has accused Chari of 'poisioning' Babuji Maharaj in court papers! He said that something was done to Babuji in his trip to west. I recollect this when i read michael's post of Babuji falling down.
Umeshchandra, later asked me to come and stay at his house near Delhi. I went there for four days, and he made me a preceptor. He seemed sincere in trying to run the mission as Babuji intended. I saw all the menuscripts that Babuji wrote while he as getting dictations from Lalaji Maharaj, Lord Krishna, Swami Vivekanada, Lord Jesus Christ, Lord Buddha etc. (there is a autobiography published from it, not many people has that copy)
Later I came to US on work (1996). Having made preceptor and US secretary of the Mission, i tried to see if i can find some good abhyasis. I tried to contact old abhyasis's from a list i got from Umeshchandra. I even attended a sitting conducted by a local preceptor made by Chari. I did not divulge my identity- said i am an abhyasi from India. I noticed that there were no pictures of Babuji Maharaj or Lalaji Maharaj in the center. There was a picture of Chari. I did not find any grace in that sunday group sitting.(my sensitivity is very good to surrounding, i can catch good and bad vibrations, thoughts etc.)
After the sitting a book was being read written by Chari. I never went there again or talked with the preceptor.
I created a website 'sahajmarg.org'. Put some basics of Babuji's teaching and the issue of sucessor representative. I scanned the court papers, Chari had presented in the court as successor representative and the one Umeshchandra presented.
This started a legal battle here in US. They(Chari's zonal secretary) contacted the domain registrar and disputed the domain. The issue went to arbitration. I worked with Umeshchandra, and presented the response to the arbitration. The decision came in our favour that we can keep the domain name. I was delighted, and so were people in india, this was probably the first time, we had won something.
This did not last long, as Chari, approched the federal court, virginia to dispute the outcome. I too hired an attorney to fight the case. My financial power and other means were extremly limited. There is nobody here that can support me in this issue. It was a drag on me personally and finacially.
When, Chari(zonal seceratary) realized, i am fighting it out, they hired one of the biggest law firm in US to fight the case (100K + would be their fees)
In 1999, I went to india to attend Babuji's centenary celebration in Shahjahanpur. I saw obvious change in Umeshchandra at that time. He did not have any Job or financial backing. He had started depending on the Mission to support himself. I did not have any problem with it, since he was doing a full time job as the president. But i saw, that the attitude was to get more money in the mission, so that he and his family can use more- support a lifestyle.
I saw politicians invited at the celebrations on the stage. They are bad everywhere, but in india its - i don't have words here.
I saw i was being used for some publicity. There were fears for Umeshchandra's life due this dispute and he was carrying a revolver in his pocket at shahjahanpur ashram.
I was sad. I realized Umeshchandra is not the representative. I discussed with the senior preceptor on whose word we had accepted him as president. He used to manage all the accounts for the ashram. He acknowledged, grave money mismangement in the mission.
I came back to US, very sad. I still had to deal with the court case, since Chari's attorney refused to accept Shri RamChandra Mission, Shahjanpur, India as an identity and was personally dragging me in the case for violating his trademarks.
My attorney, advised me to backoff, He told me he does not have means to fight the biggest law firm in US, and even if we won, they can always challenge the decision and go to supreme court and drag this for a long time. I did not have the money, or power and now no faith in Umeshchandra.
I signed the papers that i have nothing to do with the SRCM, nor will my kids! have anything to do with it.
My heart cried...still does.
Let me add one more...
There is a CD/cassette available of Babuji's talks with Danish abhyasis (1974?) The western abhyasis are impressed with Chari and inquirying about Kasturi and Chari to Babuji. A lady asks Babuji, "is Chari a saint?", Babuji gives some vague answer, but she repeats the questions. Babuji answers "Chari is Bachelors of Science"!!!
These are Masters own words, recorded, published even by Chari's organization.
Michael a dit…
Dear Brother,
Thank you so much for taking the time to write this. Your story is astonishingly similar to mine! Having met one of Lalaji's last living disciples, I am convinced that there was no desire on Lalaji's behalf to start an organization, or have successors.
I sincerely believe this whole SRCM was Babuji's creation, not Lalaji's, and it has created a life of its own that has nothing to do with the spiritual advancement of humanity.
To this day I don't understand the need for yet another spritual organization that will untimately degrade to another organized religion (if it hasn't already).
I have to say, when I met Umesh back in 1980, he did not seem very active spiritually.
Given my training as a preceptor, I know quite well how easy it is to present a facade of holiness around oneself. Umesh and Chari have done this. This facade conceals real objectives, desires and intentions.
Privately, Chari complained constantly about his disciples, their whining and foolishness. I saw people he kept close to him keeping people away from Chari when he got into that kind of mood, Yet publically, he presented a Masterly Facade.
When it all comes down to it, I believe that SRCM as an organization (either the Shajahanpur or Mumbai versions of it), does little to advance how its disciples interact in this life, and instead have them fixated on serving an organization and Master so that they can advance in the Brighter World.
This now includes aggressive legal action against opposing groups and detractors. Rumor has it, that there have been "inner circle" discussions about our blogs and a US attorney has been asked to look into how to shut us down. Of course, in the US free speech laws prohibit the expression of personal opinions. However, if this is indeed true, it is yet another sad fact of just how self centered and defensive this organization has become!
I share your sadness. Feel free to keep in touch with us.
Michael
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Michael,
The organization SRCM was created with Lalaji's approval and wishes. Babuji had lost his ego-individuality. The Autobiography i mention which contains numerous day to day events in intercummunication form says so. Infact the dictations give details that there was a big issue of successor representative after Lalaji passed away. It is in 1944, Lalaji's birthday celebration Babuji was declared as his sucessor by Ishwar Sahai (?). Lalaji, Lord Krishna, Swami vivekananda and many more had left the brighter world and were present to take care of Babuji. Lalaji Maharaj, Swami Vivekanada and Lord Krishna were his constant companions. This was printed in India around 1989. 3000 copies. From your response i am assuming you have not read it. I have read those intercommunication papers written by babuji originally in Urdu, all dictations from swami Vivekananda were in english. These were translated by Dr.S.P.Srivatava. That book is my 'Gita'. There is so much information in there, i wish more people could read it.
Michael a dit…
My Dear Friend,
Nothing of what you write can be confirmed. All comes from Babuji's dreams and creations in his mind. Even Ishwar Sahai's announcement is something only Babuji can attest to. Meanwhile there were dozens of Lalaji's disciples who present different facts. Now Chari allegedly claims to have "dreams" or have Babuji "channeled" by a third party and this information. Conveinient for him as these facts are totally un-proveable, just as your Autobiography myths are.
My friend, what I am saying is that Missions and Successors, do not matter. This may seem a bold statement to you but I believe it boils down to how the system trains its adherents to treat their fellow man/woman in this world in order to evolve and prepare for the next. If selfishness remains, then all the detachment in the world won't save you!
Personally, I was attracted to Babuji's personality, not his credentials and always bristled when these myths were propogated as they are extremely manipulative. They represent clear signs of a spiritual organization degrading to a religion. Spirituality is about experiencing God. Religions are about believing in God. Now what have you written here that is about Spirituality?
Please, keep the focus on facts and experiences when writing here, not mythology and legend determining who's in charge. We're interested in YOUR EXPERIENCES not the myths propogated to benefit a few in charge of a large organization.
Sorry for being so blunt, but you must be careful presenting un-verifiable information here as truth. Not only does it serve no purpose, but it belittles YOUR experience, which, in spirituality IS important. The facts you present are not important in any spiritual sense and only serve to sway the masses to believe in a religious hierarchy without experiencing anything.
So, if you have experiences of your own that you'd like to share, then share them here, but understand that unless you personally witnessed Vivekananda and Krishna leaving the Brighter world to be in Babuji's presence, or if you've visited the Brighter World and confirmed these facts with these individuals, I suggest that you reserve posting these myths elsewhere.
Regardless, I hope you find happiness and benefit from the path you are on.
Michael
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Michael,
I agree w.r.t the autobiography, nothing can be confirmed. Babuji said it, wrote it in his dairy and now few have it as book.
Anybody can claim it. There are few things one can look for 'Motive'
-Either the person claiming such dictations was mentally unstable
-Had desire for fame, money, material values
- or pass the 'truth' to the masses.
There could be more analysis on the isssue of motive, but my friend, i don't blame you the world is filled many pseudo guru's. Having never seen the 'good' side of the system, one would think in similar direction. I guess even i might have taken similar position.
I agree with you, the mission, sucessor does not matter. What matters to me is, my personal transformation. Am I still the same person, getting affected by every circumstances or have i 'naturally' moved to a more divine state.
There is a reason, many highly developed spiritual soul do not come out in public. The original emphasis, as i have learnt for 'sahaj marg' was propogation thru word of mouth. An abhyasi would introduce another person, if he/she sees that the there is a internal craving in the person.
I have seen that there was emphasis on 'quality' of abhyasi and never 'quantity'. We never wanted quantity. This is not for everyone to digest.
My preceptor used to tell me, this is power, and if tendencies are not understood and changed, a small thief would become very big thief. If utilized properly, the thief can become a saint.
I take trouble to write this, since it hurts when the finger is pointed to Babuji Maharaj. Please don't be hasty, leave the benefit of doubt. The system, organization did perform as ideally it should, i can attest to it. But when the quantity increased due to some organizer's enthusism, it went down.
Michael a dit…
Dear Anonymous
Apparently you have not read the blog and seem to think I did not know Babuji, but I did. I joined SRCM in 1979 and travelled to Shahjahanpur multiple times.
I am not sure whether Babuji wrote this "Auto"biography or if it was created by those around him. I was impressed with Babuji, but then again, I was also impressed with Chari. I also met some other very impressive Gurus, one was also associated with Lalaji.
I am by no means ignorant of the SRCM, or the practice of Sahaj Marg as I was a Preceptor and practiced it for over 10 years. I stand by what I say.
It is well documented that Babuji had very limited contact with Lalaji. He determined that he should announce his successorship from a dream he had after Lalaji passed away. By this time many of Lalaji's disciples and disciples of Lalaji's brother had established themselves as spiritual teachers and saw little need to follow Babuji. (Yes even Babuji mentions Lalaji's brother as a spiritual twin).
I am not judging Babuji, but am simply stating the facts. I do not believe even mentioning the dreams and visions that Babuji may or may not have had of Vivenkenanda, Krishna, Lalaji or other dead people is even remotely relevant to the spiritual experience one has in the presence of someone like Babuji.
Sadly, Anonymous, whomever he is, has decided Babuji's autobiography, which I have read, is a new religious document that everyone should read. This defeats the purpose of a spiritual practice that is supposed to develop one's own discrimination.
In today's SRCM discrimination is DEAD. It is all about blind obedience. Lions are turned into sheep while the wolves in the inner circle fight over morsels of meat.
It is a sad state of affairs, yet still some manage to extract some nectar from this rotting fruit.
Babuji was an impressive person, but he was human. He was able to convey something spiritual to others, but his legacy is rotting away as his hand picked inner circle fight over what remains of it.
I will be bold here and say that I believe he indeed made a mistake in creating SRCM and claiming exclusivity in the Sufi/Vedic heritage he gleened from his association with Lalaji. Other disciples of Lalaji chose claim any exclusive lineage. His doing so has done nothing but to muddy an otherwise simple spiritual path and establish a new religion based on myth and blind faith in dreams and visions and possibly illusions.
Michael
Alexis a dit…
Mr. Anonymous,
I just have discovered your comment (thanks to Don). It is terribly interesting. But there are things which I don't understand. Perhaps, you could explain me…
- You said Dr SP Srivastava was the 'working president' of the Mission, and yourself were the secretary when you went to the USA. Is it the SRCM of Chari or another one ? Is there two Missions : Umeshchandra's Mission and Chari's Mission ? Who is Srivastava ?
- You said that in your area of origin, people do not like Chari. What area is it? Uttar Pradesh ?
- You said Lalaji didn't like André Porey. How could they have known each other ?
Thanks for explanations
4d-Don a dit…
Anonymous and Michael...
Could one of you clarify a few things for me:
1. Which region of India are you from?
2. Who is Dr. Srivastava? What Mission is he from? Are we speaking of another Mission and not the SRCM?
3. You say you arrived in USA as "secretary of the Mission". Which Mission? SRCM of another Mission?
4. You mention 2 letters, one to Chari and one to Umeshchandra, do you have copies? Do you know who does?
You say:
I have also heard from my preceptor that Andre Porey was a strong contender for the successorship. Babuji had more liking for him, but Lalaji disapproved him, since Lalaji felt that Andrey Pore or people around him are not introvert and would utilize the power for material purpose. I recollect this as i read your post on people dressed in black showing up for meditation.
Did Lalaji know Mr. Porey? Could you clarify how that can be?
Thanks for your testimonial, anonymous, and your info.
If anyone else can clarify, or shed some light on these issues, please do so.
4d-don
Christian a dit…
Hi Anonymous,
You said you have copies of the letters used by ChariTM and Unesh to claim their succession.
These letters could be published on Michael's blog if he agrees as well as you - in the form of pictures resulting from a scan.
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Thanks to all who have expressed interest in the posting.
-When Babuji left and chari came out with the sucessor letter, there were problems. There were factions.
- A working group was formed and S.P.Srivastava was choosen as the president. This is the same group -original SRCM shahjanpur HQ center. This was not immediate, it took a while (few years). The ashram was not getting properly maintained after Babuji.
Later this-Presidentship was passed on to Umeshchandra. Since Umeshchandra came out with a letter showing(1994), he is the appointed representative by Babuji.
Just to clarify, I have never had any association with SRCM-Chari. I have never met chari. My association has always been with SRCM, Shahjahanpur, India. BTW, alexis, there are many factions of SRCM, Chari's is one of them and it has large number.
Regarding Andrey Porey, What i wrote i got it from my preceptor. This was in 1990. How does Lalaji know Andrey? Well we are going to cross the physical boundry here to answer that.
Lalaji was almost a constant companion of Babuji Maharaj, it is evident from Babuji's dairy. From the kind of questions, doubts, i get here, I almost certain, nobody in this group has read it. I have not read the book 'Whispers of Truth ?" from Chari, so i cannot say whether its the same as what i am referring.
Chari has no access to Babuji Maharaj's diary. It was Lalaji's wish as well as Babuji's wish to have it printed after Babuji Maharaj leaves the physical body. Umeshchandra and now his son Navneet has it. Babuji used to have daily communication with departed souls. Originally written in urdu and english. This work was translated by Dr.S.P.Srivastava.
This is offcourse a very controversial aspect. We all need proof. A material proof, of a non-material 'thing'!
I have been discouraged by Michael, not to put stuff that cannot be proved or can be imaginary. The Irony is, What is false is getting proved in the courts! and survives in masses! (in this physical world!)
Friends, please remember Chari was not the only person close to Babuji Maharaj, I have known many senior perceptors who were very close to Babuji Maharaj.
It should not matter which region i am from in India. I did visit Shahjahanpur every year from 1987 onwards with 1996.
I have no objection to providing the letter chari or Umeshchandra is using to claim successorship, this were submitted to Supreme court of India towards the court dispute.
Just a word of caution to the enthusiastic folks here. I have been burnt by this and i personally would not like others to take that road.
My 'only' purpose to write all this is to share and help and never to 'bitch'. I can never do that for any thing that involves 'Babuji's' name.
call me 'A'
Michael a dit…
A,
Thanks for providing more information. As for your disappointment in me for not accepting the un-proven myths, It is not about tangible vs untangilbe or Supreme Court vs Babuji's visions, it is the deflection of focus on one's own spiritual experiences and the creation of Myth that is faith based rather than experiential that I have an issue with.
These Myths tend to cause the Masses to "follow" a Master rather than pursue their own spiritual practice.
Michael
Christian a dit…
1) So, how do we proceed with these letters if you are ok to display them?
2) I have asked on this blog to RK Pilani how to get the book you are talking about but had no answer. Is there a way to buy it somewhere?
3) I surely do not want to go in the direction of an open conflict and that's why I try to discourage it by showing that the cure could be worse. Our situation is not to claim being the SRCMtm as was yours or that of others who had this kind of problem.
Alexis a dit…
If I well understood, Babuji died in 1983, Chari presents its successor letter which is refused and a working group is created and chaired by Dr SP Srivastava (1983-94). Chari didn't be pleased and he constituted its own movement in parallel.
In 1994, Umeshchandra shows a letter which is recognized, SP Srivastava dissolves the group and Umeshchandra becomes official president of the Mission. You (Mr A.) are named secretary of the Mission in the United States in 1996 and you create a website...
It means there are 2 Missions, one official chaired by SP Srivastava first (1983-94) and after by Umeshchandra (1994-today), the other one unofficial chaired by Chari since 1983.
Am I mistaken ?
Do you know why Umeshchandra waited 1994 to show its letter ?
KC Narayana, son of Dr KC Varadachari, said he saw this letter in 83 or before. He said also Chari's letter was authentic, Umeshchandra's letter wasn't...
Do you know Narayana ? What is your impression ? And about Dr Varadachari ?
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Alexis,
your summary/understanding of the mission situation is correct.
Why did Umeshchandra waited for so long? I did not get a clear
answer. I did ask it.
There many division or preceptors practising by themselves, like Ragvendra rao, KC Narayana, Kasturiji and many more.
I have never met Dr.Vardhachari, But i know my preceptor used to speak very high of him. From some of the letters that are published online between him and Babuji, he was the chosen sucessor by Babuji, but he did not live long here.
I do not have much knowledge about KC Narayana. He seems to keep the door not wide open, maybe from bad experiences from abyasis following different group.
Here is my thought - purely personal, Most of the preceptors in India are doing good service and are keen on following the principles of Babuji maharaj, except the well known SRCM-Chari. There may be some good folks in there too.
Michael, i understand where you are comming from, but the onus of blindly following the Master and not the principles lies on the disciple.
I did accept the letter Umeshchandra produced, i did experience the 'grace' from him. But when the worldly actions were not based on 'principles' i moved on.
As the indian system, the guru is regarded as 'living god'. There is no other form of God you can experience physically. You may hit me for this, but i do accept that. But please remember Babuji has mentioned that it is better to remain without a Guru, instead of choosing a wrong one. The tests for such a guru are very high. I have and would test a guru to almost every doubt that comes across in my mind. Real faith develops following that, otherwise its all sheeps following.
Christian, The book i am refering, i have serious doubts if its available now.
My 2 cents to all the abhyasis, The method is correct, the principles are correct, pray directly to Babuji maharaj and he will help you. Its from my experience.
I am not sure how i can upload the documents here.
A
Michael a dit…
All,
There are not 2 but at least 3 SRCM groups now that KC Narayana has started ISRC.
The point that I would emphasize is that all these senior members, who claim all to have achieved the "Central Region" are fighting over an organization and successorship to it. This entire dynamic makes a mockery of spiritual attainment - and personally makes me not give a hoot about their spiritual achievments. They are behaving like the worst of human beings here on Earth and making a mess of things - Perhaps the brighter world is just a safe place to keep these dangerous souls safely away from humanity after death?
I will state again, and I know you all will not like this, but Babuji created this mess! He decided to create the Mission, claim himself sole successor of Lalaji and claim that only through Him and His Mission could one practically attain the Central Region. He attracted lots of impressive people into his fold and develped a strong power base with their combined energy.
I'm not questioning Babuji's sincerity or whether he had the dreams and visions that he wrote about, I am simply saying that he has created an organization and a culture that fostered power mongering and narcisissim.
Meanwhile there is a legacy that goes beyond SRCM - Lots of groups following Lalaji and his Brother. The Golden Sufi folks, associated with Irina Tweedie (Author of "Daughter of Fire") come from Lalaji's Brother's lineage. I believe they have preserved more of the basic principles that existed in Lalaji's days - no sole successor, etc...
So Babuji chose to deviate from the direction that Lalaji, his brother and their other disciples took of not having any real organization, nor any sole successorship to fight over.
I stand by my claim that the SRCM and the whole concept of Successors is done to control the masses. Spiritually focused individuals will find the right person or group to be associated with. Legal papers, organizations, and castles to meditate in, are not necessary - that is unless one desires to build a powerbase and a mass of sheep-like disciples to control. Who benefits from that?
Sorry to dissappoint those who still hold onto Babuji's legacy, but the truth is, his legacy is rotting away with every splinter group and "Central Region" disciple who claims to be pure path to the Brighter World.
Honestly, what is lost in all this is the whole concept of human development. There seems to be little concern for acting selflessly, and serving humanity without expectetion of getting something in return. It's all about "THE MISSION"...
What about HUMANITY? What about charity and forgiveness? What about honoring one's family and serving one's community?
How did all these principles get lost? Because everyone is so fixated on serving the Mission so that they can attain the Central Region so that they can become the next Master or at least become part of is Inner Circle!
Sad, very sad.
La version des faits historiques qu'on lui a rapporté est qu'à la mort de Babuji en 1983, Rajagopalachari a tenté de faire valoir ses droits à la présidence de la SRCM mais que cela a été contesté. Babuji l'aurait démis de l'ensemble de ses fonctions vers 1980. Un groupe de travail a été mis en place et S.P. Srivastava en a été nommé président.
En 1994, le fils de Babuji, Umeshchandra Saxena a fait valoir ses droits à la présidence et ils ont été reconnus. S.P. Srivastava a démissionné au profit d'Umeshchandra qui préside donc la SRCM historique depuis lors. En 1996, A. est parti aux Etats-Unis, nommé par Umeshchandra secrétaire de la SRCM historique dans ce pays. Il a créé un site web sur lequel il publiait les 2 lettres de nomination d'Umeshchandra et de Chari signées par Babuji. Cela a débuté une bataille juridique entre les 2 mouvements…
Comme le dit si justement Michael, il n'y a pas un, ni deux mais 3 mouvements aujourd'hui qui se réclament de l'héritage du Sahaj marg de Babuji : la SRCM historique présidée par Srivastava de 1983 à 94 puis par Umeshchandra depuis 1994, la SRCM® de Rajagopachari depuis 1983 qui est une société à but non lucratif enregistrée en Californie et enfin l'ISRC de Narayana depuis août 1991. Sans compter tous les individus qui ont démissionné et véhiculent en leur nom personnel les enseignements de Babuji (Kasturi, etc.) …
Vous pouvez retrouver plus complètement les extraits cités ci-dessous de la discussion entre A., Michael, Christian, Don et moi sur le blog de Michael (http://innercircleofsrcm.blogspot.com) :
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
At age 17 (1987) i had strong desire to understand the meaning and purpose of life. Studied Vivekananda, and started meditating on my own. I came across 'Reality at Dawn'. I was impressed and decided to meet Babuji.(I am an indian living in India). I met a local preceptor Mr.M. After couple of meetings he said "I know what you are looking for, I request you to join our mission. Give me six months of time. Do what i say for six month. At the end we will sit on same platform. If you feel i have wasted your time, your free to give me any abuses you like".
I was touched by the humility and openness. I told him, i would not question for one year.
Later during sittting and talks i realized, Babuji had passed in 1983. I went to Shahjanpur for 'Lalaji's Birthday celebration', the same year. I was already feeling the difference in my condition/experience the grace at Babuji's Samadhi and his house. As i got involved i learnt that there is some issue going on with Babuji's Sucessor. Mr.M told me that Babuji left none. We have a working president Dr.S.P.Srivastava.
I used to meet my preceptor almost three times a week. During talk, i understood that Chari is claiming the sucessorship and came to know about all the legal issues in India too. He mentioned to me that, while Babuji's body was still burning at Shahjanpur, Chari had the paper circulated that he is nominated as the president of mission. Chari was general secretary of the mission till 1980(?), he was removed from all postions after that. Chari was the only person appointed by Babuji to make new preceptors. My preceptor was made a preceptor by Chari!.
But he refused to accept chari as the representative. The personality he described to me about chari and what i read from your blogs are identical!
Infact, Chari send out a letter to my preceptor, that his preceptorship is cancelled, and his powers are revoked. He showed that letter to me when i went for a sitting to his home. Asked me to sit for a sitting and tell him how true it is. I felt no difference in the sitting, it was still the same grace i have been receiving.
Unfortunatly, my preceptor left us in 1993. Babuji that i know, SahajMarg i know, the grace i feel is all due to his efforts. In my very close association with him for six plus years, I have never, not even once, seen him lose his cool or a change in the tone or pitch of his voice. I was like his son, so there nothing hidden from me or as a matter of fact anyone. There was no 'inner circle'.
I had developed good relation with preceptors of neighboring cities too by that time. And i saw very similar personalities. None of them accepted Chari as the successor though.
Since they wanted to run the Mission, they met with the president S.P.Srivastava and decided on ways to make new preceptor and made new one for my city. I took regular sitting from him and felt similar grace too.
I have also heard from my preceptor that Andre Porey was a strong contender for the successorship. Babuji had more liking for him, but Lalaji disapproved him, since Lalaji felt that Andrey Pore or people around him are not introvert and would utilize the power for material purpose. I recollect this as i read your post on people dressed in black showing up for meditation.
As far as i know, my preceptor told me that till the end Babuji was always saying that i did not find one to nominate.
The center was working fine, but we got a letter now from Umeshchandra saxena that he is the sucessor representative. We all got copies of the letter that Babuji Maharaj wrote to him on mission letter head with Babuji's Signature.
I have seen the letter that Umeshchandra produced and the one that chari has produced. I still have copies of both. I rejected the copy chari produced simply by reading its content. Babuji, as i have known him from my preceptor, does nothing without mentioning his guru Lalaji Maharaj. A successor nomination letter without the name of Lalaji Maharaj is 'impossible'.
The letter that umeshchandra produced seemed more in line with Babuji's style. "By the grace of God and Lalaji Maharaj..."
I must mention here, my preceptor told me that when Babuji used to travel west, he used to leave few blank signed papers on mission letterhead for administrative reasons. Since he worked in court, he was very perticular and always checked back on the papers when he came back. In one of his last trips, he saw three blank signed letters were missing. He registered a complain at local police station for records.
Since one of the senior preceptor (he was one of the few, who had soul connection with Babuji-initiation) in neighbouring city, accepted that letter, we all accepted it.
I took sitting from umeshchandra when he came to my city. The sitting reminded me of the condition i felt, at Babuji's Samadhi and Babuji's house. Tremendous grace. But i was very perplexed with the petty talk and other behaviour of Umeshchandra. I question this to the Senior preceptor-whom we were relying on.
He agreed with my observation, asked me to watch and not react. I kept did not question much.
Umeshchandra has accused Chari of 'poisioning' Babuji Maharaj in court papers! He said that something was done to Babuji in his trip to west. I recollect this when i read michael's post of Babuji falling down.
Umeshchandra, later asked me to come and stay at his house near Delhi. I went there for four days, and he made me a preceptor. He seemed sincere in trying to run the mission as Babuji intended. I saw all the menuscripts that Babuji wrote while he as getting dictations from Lalaji Maharaj, Lord Krishna, Swami Vivekanada, Lord Jesus Christ, Lord Buddha etc. (there is a autobiography published from it, not many people has that copy)
Later I came to US on work (1996). Having made preceptor and US secretary of the Mission, i tried to see if i can find some good abhyasis. I tried to contact old abhyasis's from a list i got from Umeshchandra. I even attended a sitting conducted by a local preceptor made by Chari. I did not divulge my identity- said i am an abhyasi from India. I noticed that there were no pictures of Babuji Maharaj or Lalaji Maharaj in the center. There was a picture of Chari. I did not find any grace in that sunday group sitting.(my sensitivity is very good to surrounding, i can catch good and bad vibrations, thoughts etc.)
After the sitting a book was being read written by Chari. I never went there again or talked with the preceptor.
I created a website 'sahajmarg.org'. Put some basics of Babuji's teaching and the issue of sucessor representative. I scanned the court papers, Chari had presented in the court as successor representative and the one Umeshchandra presented.
This started a legal battle here in US. They(Chari's zonal secretary) contacted the domain registrar and disputed the domain. The issue went to arbitration. I worked with Umeshchandra, and presented the response to the arbitration. The decision came in our favour that we can keep the domain name. I was delighted, and so were people in india, this was probably the first time, we had won something.
This did not last long, as Chari, approched the federal court, virginia to dispute the outcome. I too hired an attorney to fight the case. My financial power and other means were extremly limited. There is nobody here that can support me in this issue. It was a drag on me personally and finacially.
When, Chari(zonal seceratary) realized, i am fighting it out, they hired one of the biggest law firm in US to fight the case (100K + would be their fees)
In 1999, I went to india to attend Babuji's centenary celebration in Shahjahanpur. I saw obvious change in Umeshchandra at that time. He did not have any Job or financial backing. He had started depending on the Mission to support himself. I did not have any problem with it, since he was doing a full time job as the president. But i saw, that the attitude was to get more money in the mission, so that he and his family can use more- support a lifestyle.
I saw politicians invited at the celebrations on the stage. They are bad everywhere, but in india its - i don't have words here.
I saw i was being used for some publicity. There were fears for Umeshchandra's life due this dispute and he was carrying a revolver in his pocket at shahjahanpur ashram.
I was sad. I realized Umeshchandra is not the representative. I discussed with the senior preceptor on whose word we had accepted him as president. He used to manage all the accounts for the ashram. He acknowledged, grave money mismangement in the mission.
I came back to US, very sad. I still had to deal with the court case, since Chari's attorney refused to accept Shri RamChandra Mission, Shahjanpur, India as an identity and was personally dragging me in the case for violating his trademarks.
My attorney, advised me to backoff, He told me he does not have means to fight the biggest law firm in US, and even if we won, they can always challenge the decision and go to supreme court and drag this for a long time. I did not have the money, or power and now no faith in Umeshchandra.
I signed the papers that i have nothing to do with the SRCM, nor will my kids! have anything to do with it.
My heart cried...still does.
Let me add one more...
There is a CD/cassette available of Babuji's talks with Danish abhyasis (1974?) The western abhyasis are impressed with Chari and inquirying about Kasturi and Chari to Babuji. A lady asks Babuji, "is Chari a saint?", Babuji gives some vague answer, but she repeats the questions. Babuji answers "Chari is Bachelors of Science"!!!
These are Masters own words, recorded, published even by Chari's organization.
Michael a dit…
Dear Brother,
Thank you so much for taking the time to write this. Your story is astonishingly similar to mine! Having met one of Lalaji's last living disciples, I am convinced that there was no desire on Lalaji's behalf to start an organization, or have successors.
I sincerely believe this whole SRCM was Babuji's creation, not Lalaji's, and it has created a life of its own that has nothing to do with the spiritual advancement of humanity.
To this day I don't understand the need for yet another spritual organization that will untimately degrade to another organized religion (if it hasn't already).
I have to say, when I met Umesh back in 1980, he did not seem very active spiritually.
Given my training as a preceptor, I know quite well how easy it is to present a facade of holiness around oneself. Umesh and Chari have done this. This facade conceals real objectives, desires and intentions.
Privately, Chari complained constantly about his disciples, their whining and foolishness. I saw people he kept close to him keeping people away from Chari when he got into that kind of mood, Yet publically, he presented a Masterly Facade.
When it all comes down to it, I believe that SRCM as an organization (either the Shajahanpur or Mumbai versions of it), does little to advance how its disciples interact in this life, and instead have them fixated on serving an organization and Master so that they can advance in the Brighter World.
This now includes aggressive legal action against opposing groups and detractors. Rumor has it, that there have been "inner circle" discussions about our blogs and a US attorney has been asked to look into how to shut us down. Of course, in the US free speech laws prohibit the expression of personal opinions. However, if this is indeed true, it is yet another sad fact of just how self centered and defensive this organization has become!
I share your sadness. Feel free to keep in touch with us.
Michael
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Michael,
The organization SRCM was created with Lalaji's approval and wishes. Babuji had lost his ego-individuality. The Autobiography i mention which contains numerous day to day events in intercummunication form says so. Infact the dictations give details that there was a big issue of successor representative after Lalaji passed away. It is in 1944, Lalaji's birthday celebration Babuji was declared as his sucessor by Ishwar Sahai (?). Lalaji, Lord Krishna, Swami vivekananda and many more had left the brighter world and were present to take care of Babuji. Lalaji Maharaj, Swami Vivekanada and Lord Krishna were his constant companions. This was printed in India around 1989. 3000 copies. From your response i am assuming you have not read it. I have read those intercommunication papers written by babuji originally in Urdu, all dictations from swami Vivekananda were in english. These were translated by Dr.S.P.Srivatava. That book is my 'Gita'. There is so much information in there, i wish more people could read it.
Michael a dit…
My Dear Friend,
Nothing of what you write can be confirmed. All comes from Babuji's dreams and creations in his mind. Even Ishwar Sahai's announcement is something only Babuji can attest to. Meanwhile there were dozens of Lalaji's disciples who present different facts. Now Chari allegedly claims to have "dreams" or have Babuji "channeled" by a third party and this information. Conveinient for him as these facts are totally un-proveable, just as your Autobiography myths are.
My friend, what I am saying is that Missions and Successors, do not matter. This may seem a bold statement to you but I believe it boils down to how the system trains its adherents to treat their fellow man/woman in this world in order to evolve and prepare for the next. If selfishness remains, then all the detachment in the world won't save you!
Personally, I was attracted to Babuji's personality, not his credentials and always bristled when these myths were propogated as they are extremely manipulative. They represent clear signs of a spiritual organization degrading to a religion. Spirituality is about experiencing God. Religions are about believing in God. Now what have you written here that is about Spirituality?
Please, keep the focus on facts and experiences when writing here, not mythology and legend determining who's in charge. We're interested in YOUR EXPERIENCES not the myths propogated to benefit a few in charge of a large organization.
Sorry for being so blunt, but you must be careful presenting un-verifiable information here as truth. Not only does it serve no purpose, but it belittles YOUR experience, which, in spirituality IS important. The facts you present are not important in any spiritual sense and only serve to sway the masses to believe in a religious hierarchy without experiencing anything.
So, if you have experiences of your own that you'd like to share, then share them here, but understand that unless you personally witnessed Vivekananda and Krishna leaving the Brighter world to be in Babuji's presence, or if you've visited the Brighter World and confirmed these facts with these individuals, I suggest that you reserve posting these myths elsewhere.
Regardless, I hope you find happiness and benefit from the path you are on.
Michael
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Michael,
I agree w.r.t the autobiography, nothing can be confirmed. Babuji said it, wrote it in his dairy and now few have it as book.
Anybody can claim it. There are few things one can look for 'Motive'
-Either the person claiming such dictations was mentally unstable
-Had desire for fame, money, material values
- or pass the 'truth' to the masses.
There could be more analysis on the isssue of motive, but my friend, i don't blame you the world is filled many pseudo guru's. Having never seen the 'good' side of the system, one would think in similar direction. I guess even i might have taken similar position.
I agree with you, the mission, sucessor does not matter. What matters to me is, my personal transformation. Am I still the same person, getting affected by every circumstances or have i 'naturally' moved to a more divine state.
There is a reason, many highly developed spiritual soul do not come out in public. The original emphasis, as i have learnt for 'sahaj marg' was propogation thru word of mouth. An abhyasi would introduce another person, if he/she sees that the there is a internal craving in the person.
I have seen that there was emphasis on 'quality' of abhyasi and never 'quantity'. We never wanted quantity. This is not for everyone to digest.
My preceptor used to tell me, this is power, and if tendencies are not understood and changed, a small thief would become very big thief. If utilized properly, the thief can become a saint.
I take trouble to write this, since it hurts when the finger is pointed to Babuji Maharaj. Please don't be hasty, leave the benefit of doubt. The system, organization did perform as ideally it should, i can attest to it. But when the quantity increased due to some organizer's enthusism, it went down.
Michael a dit…
Dear Anonymous
Apparently you have not read the blog and seem to think I did not know Babuji, but I did. I joined SRCM in 1979 and travelled to Shahjahanpur multiple times.
I am not sure whether Babuji wrote this "Auto"biography or if it was created by those around him. I was impressed with Babuji, but then again, I was also impressed with Chari. I also met some other very impressive Gurus, one was also associated with Lalaji.
I am by no means ignorant of the SRCM, or the practice of Sahaj Marg as I was a Preceptor and practiced it for over 10 years. I stand by what I say.
It is well documented that Babuji had very limited contact with Lalaji. He determined that he should announce his successorship from a dream he had after Lalaji passed away. By this time many of Lalaji's disciples and disciples of Lalaji's brother had established themselves as spiritual teachers and saw little need to follow Babuji. (Yes even Babuji mentions Lalaji's brother as a spiritual twin).
I am not judging Babuji, but am simply stating the facts. I do not believe even mentioning the dreams and visions that Babuji may or may not have had of Vivenkenanda, Krishna, Lalaji or other dead people is even remotely relevant to the spiritual experience one has in the presence of someone like Babuji.
Sadly, Anonymous, whomever he is, has decided Babuji's autobiography, which I have read, is a new religious document that everyone should read. This defeats the purpose of a spiritual practice that is supposed to develop one's own discrimination.
In today's SRCM discrimination is DEAD. It is all about blind obedience. Lions are turned into sheep while the wolves in the inner circle fight over morsels of meat.
It is a sad state of affairs, yet still some manage to extract some nectar from this rotting fruit.
Babuji was an impressive person, but he was human. He was able to convey something spiritual to others, but his legacy is rotting away as his hand picked inner circle fight over what remains of it.
I will be bold here and say that I believe he indeed made a mistake in creating SRCM and claiming exclusivity in the Sufi/Vedic heritage he gleened from his association with Lalaji. Other disciples of Lalaji chose claim any exclusive lineage. His doing so has done nothing but to muddy an otherwise simple spiritual path and establish a new religion based on myth and blind faith in dreams and visions and possibly illusions.
Michael
Alexis a dit…
Mr. Anonymous,
I just have discovered your comment (thanks to Don). It is terribly interesting. But there are things which I don't understand. Perhaps, you could explain me…
- You said Dr SP Srivastava was the 'working president' of the Mission, and yourself were the secretary when you went to the USA. Is it the SRCM of Chari or another one ? Is there two Missions : Umeshchandra's Mission and Chari's Mission ? Who is Srivastava ?
- You said that in your area of origin, people do not like Chari. What area is it? Uttar Pradesh ?
- You said Lalaji didn't like André Porey. How could they have known each other ?
Thanks for explanations
4d-Don a dit…
Anonymous and Michael...
Could one of you clarify a few things for me:
1. Which region of India are you from?
2. Who is Dr. Srivastava? What Mission is he from? Are we speaking of another Mission and not the SRCM?
3. You say you arrived in USA as "secretary of the Mission". Which Mission? SRCM of another Mission?
4. You mention 2 letters, one to Chari and one to Umeshchandra, do you have copies? Do you know who does?
You say:
I have also heard from my preceptor that Andre Porey was a strong contender for the successorship. Babuji had more liking for him, but Lalaji disapproved him, since Lalaji felt that Andrey Pore or people around him are not introvert and would utilize the power for material purpose. I recollect this as i read your post on people dressed in black showing up for meditation.
Did Lalaji know Mr. Porey? Could you clarify how that can be?
Thanks for your testimonial, anonymous, and your info.
If anyone else can clarify, or shed some light on these issues, please do so.
4d-don
Christian a dit…
Hi Anonymous,
You said you have copies of the letters used by ChariTM and Unesh to claim their succession.
These letters could be published on Michael's blog if he agrees as well as you - in the form of pictures resulting from a scan.
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Thanks to all who have expressed interest in the posting.
-When Babuji left and chari came out with the sucessor letter, there were problems. There were factions.
- A working group was formed and S.P.Srivastava was choosen as the president. This is the same group -original SRCM shahjanpur HQ center. This was not immediate, it took a while (few years). The ashram was not getting properly maintained after Babuji.
Later this-Presidentship was passed on to Umeshchandra. Since Umeshchandra came out with a letter showing(1994), he is the appointed representative by Babuji.
Just to clarify, I have never had any association with SRCM-Chari. I have never met chari. My association has always been with SRCM, Shahjahanpur, India. BTW, alexis, there are many factions of SRCM, Chari's is one of them and it has large number.
Regarding Andrey Porey, What i wrote i got it from my preceptor. This was in 1990. How does Lalaji know Andrey? Well we are going to cross the physical boundry here to answer that.
Lalaji was almost a constant companion of Babuji Maharaj, it is evident from Babuji's dairy. From the kind of questions, doubts, i get here, I almost certain, nobody in this group has read it. I have not read the book 'Whispers of Truth ?" from Chari, so i cannot say whether its the same as what i am referring.
Chari has no access to Babuji Maharaj's diary. It was Lalaji's wish as well as Babuji's wish to have it printed after Babuji Maharaj leaves the physical body. Umeshchandra and now his son Navneet has it. Babuji used to have daily communication with departed souls. Originally written in urdu and english. This work was translated by Dr.S.P.Srivastava.
This is offcourse a very controversial aspect. We all need proof. A material proof, of a non-material 'thing'!
I have been discouraged by Michael, not to put stuff that cannot be proved or can be imaginary. The Irony is, What is false is getting proved in the courts! and survives in masses! (in this physical world!)
Friends, please remember Chari was not the only person close to Babuji Maharaj, I have known many senior perceptors who were very close to Babuji Maharaj.
It should not matter which region i am from in India. I did visit Shahjahanpur every year from 1987 onwards with 1996.
I have no objection to providing the letter chari or Umeshchandra is using to claim successorship, this were submitted to Supreme court of India towards the court dispute.
Just a word of caution to the enthusiastic folks here. I have been burnt by this and i personally would not like others to take that road.
My 'only' purpose to write all this is to share and help and never to 'bitch'. I can never do that for any thing that involves 'Babuji's' name.
call me 'A'
Michael a dit…
A,
Thanks for providing more information. As for your disappointment in me for not accepting the un-proven myths, It is not about tangible vs untangilbe or Supreme Court vs Babuji's visions, it is the deflection of focus on one's own spiritual experiences and the creation of Myth that is faith based rather than experiential that I have an issue with.
These Myths tend to cause the Masses to "follow" a Master rather than pursue their own spiritual practice.
Michael
Christian a dit…
1) So, how do we proceed with these letters if you are ok to display them?
2) I have asked on this blog to RK Pilani how to get the book you are talking about but had no answer. Is there a way to buy it somewhere?
3) I surely do not want to go in the direction of an open conflict and that's why I try to discourage it by showing that the cure could be worse. Our situation is not to claim being the SRCMtm as was yours or that of others who had this kind of problem.
Alexis a dit…
If I well understood, Babuji died in 1983, Chari presents its successor letter which is refused and a working group is created and chaired by Dr SP Srivastava (1983-94). Chari didn't be pleased and he constituted its own movement in parallel.
In 1994, Umeshchandra shows a letter which is recognized, SP Srivastava dissolves the group and Umeshchandra becomes official president of the Mission. You (Mr A.) are named secretary of the Mission in the United States in 1996 and you create a website...
It means there are 2 Missions, one official chaired by SP Srivastava first (1983-94) and after by Umeshchandra (1994-today), the other one unofficial chaired by Chari since 1983.
Am I mistaken ?
Do you know why Umeshchandra waited 1994 to show its letter ?
KC Narayana, son of Dr KC Varadachari, said he saw this letter in 83 or before. He said also Chari's letter was authentic, Umeshchandra's letter wasn't...
Do you know Narayana ? What is your impression ? And about Dr Varadachari ?
Un utilisateur anonyme a dit…
Alexis,
your summary/understanding of the mission situation is correct.
Why did Umeshchandra waited for so long? I did not get a clear
answer. I did ask it.
There many division or preceptors practising by themselves, like Ragvendra rao, KC Narayana, Kasturiji and many more.
I have never met Dr.Vardhachari, But i know my preceptor used to speak very high of him. From some of the letters that are published online between him and Babuji, he was the chosen sucessor by Babuji, but he did not live long here.
I do not have much knowledge about KC Narayana. He seems to keep the door not wide open, maybe from bad experiences from abyasis following different group.
Here is my thought - purely personal, Most of the preceptors in India are doing good service and are keen on following the principles of Babuji maharaj, except the well known SRCM-Chari. There may be some good folks in there too.
Michael, i understand where you are comming from, but the onus of blindly following the Master and not the principles lies on the disciple.
I did accept the letter Umeshchandra produced, i did experience the 'grace' from him. But when the worldly actions were not based on 'principles' i moved on.
As the indian system, the guru is regarded as 'living god'. There is no other form of God you can experience physically. You may hit me for this, but i do accept that. But please remember Babuji has mentioned that it is better to remain without a Guru, instead of choosing a wrong one. The tests for such a guru are very high. I have and would test a guru to almost every doubt that comes across in my mind. Real faith develops following that, otherwise its all sheeps following.
Christian, The book i am refering, i have serious doubts if its available now.
My 2 cents to all the abhyasis, The method is correct, the principles are correct, pray directly to Babuji maharaj and he will help you. Its from my experience.
I am not sure how i can upload the documents here.
A
Michael a dit…
All,
There are not 2 but at least 3 SRCM groups now that KC Narayana has started ISRC.
The point that I would emphasize is that all these senior members, who claim all to have achieved the "Central Region" are fighting over an organization and successorship to it. This entire dynamic makes a mockery of spiritual attainment - and personally makes me not give a hoot about their spiritual achievments. They are behaving like the worst of human beings here on Earth and making a mess of things - Perhaps the brighter world is just a safe place to keep these dangerous souls safely away from humanity after death?
I will state again, and I know you all will not like this, but Babuji created this mess! He decided to create the Mission, claim himself sole successor of Lalaji and claim that only through Him and His Mission could one practically attain the Central Region. He attracted lots of impressive people into his fold and develped a strong power base with their combined energy.
I'm not questioning Babuji's sincerity or whether he had the dreams and visions that he wrote about, I am simply saying that he has created an organization and a culture that fostered power mongering and narcisissim.
Meanwhile there is a legacy that goes beyond SRCM - Lots of groups following Lalaji and his Brother. The Golden Sufi folks, associated with Irina Tweedie (Author of "Daughter of Fire") come from Lalaji's Brother's lineage. I believe they have preserved more of the basic principles that existed in Lalaji's days - no sole successor, etc...
So Babuji chose to deviate from the direction that Lalaji, his brother and their other disciples took of not having any real organization, nor any sole successorship to fight over.
I stand by my claim that the SRCM and the whole concept of Successors is done to control the masses. Spiritually focused individuals will find the right person or group to be associated with. Legal papers, organizations, and castles to meditate in, are not necessary - that is unless one desires to build a powerbase and a mass of sheep-like disciples to control. Who benefits from that?
Sorry to dissappoint those who still hold onto Babuji's legacy, but the truth is, his legacy is rotting away with every splinter group and "Central Region" disciple who claims to be pure path to the Brighter World.
Honestly, what is lost in all this is the whole concept of human development. There seems to be little concern for acting selflessly, and serving humanity without expectetion of getting something in return. It's all about "THE MISSION"...
What about HUMANITY? What about charity and forgiveness? What about honoring one's family and serving one's community?
How did all these principles get lost? Because everyone is so fixated on serving the Mission so that they can attain the Central Region so that they can become the next Master or at least become part of is Inner Circle!
Sad, very sad.
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